Spanish toponyms in Catalonia

Trebots @ Monday January 30th 2006 14:59

The Cataloonies are running a campaign to de-Castilianise Google Earth. Stick your oar in too, should you feel so inclined...

  1. Marc
    January 31st 2006 20:24

    Thanks Trevor for the diffusion.

    You're really biased. New is completely biased. This is a technical issue, nor a political issue.

    We are asking for the use of *official* toponymy. I think you need to learn some basic facts about Catalonia and the history of XX century.

  2. Trevor ap Patnarthur
    January 31st 2006 21:45

    As I tried to explain over on the forum, I believe that maps should adopt the bottom-up approach by reflecting actual usage, which for many locations delivers two predominant forms, depending on the user's language of choice. You believe that toponymy should be imposed top-down by an unrepresentative political class obsessed with the obliteration of Spanish. A great demon in a flame-filled pit is waiting for you.

  3. Trevor
    December 16th 2008 09:44

    Good news just in: Marc Belzunces is being whacked for refusing to undertake his civic duty and act as an election official

  4. Tom
    December 16th 2008 10:22

    Just had a quick look at the Google Earth forum... quite a stand you took there.

    As the Google search test no longer works (Catalan toponyms are now significantly more popular), I assume you'll be backing Marc's campaign for a bottom-up approach based on actual usage rather than some obscure top-down naming system imposed by a faceless unrepresentative (and indeed unelected) bureaucracy obsessed by the elimination of Catalan. Or would that go against your political beliefs and affiliation with the UPA-Dance party or whatever they're called?

  5. boynamedsue
    December 16th 2008 12:26

    I tend to gree with Tom on this.... I'd love to see Catalan nationalists accept the use of Spanish toponyms when folk speak Spanish, especially when they insist on saying "Terol", "Osca" and "Madrit" (I may have made one of those up), but the Spanish names are on there way out.

    I'd say that the Spanish name should be used only where it's got current usage in English.

  6. Judith
    December 16th 2008 18:18

    Follow the baldie to picturesque Demasiadolimpio de Cabritos, a mountain town sited in the Spanish seaside province of Gerona.

    There you can also visit the premises of the Jefatura Provincial de UPyD, a bulwark of liberal democracy in times of ever growing totalitarianism and a centre of resistance against ethno-fanaticism in this part of Spain

  7. Trevor
    December 16th 2008 20:39

    I think I recognise that monster.

  8. anonin2
    December 17th 2008 07:26

    Whatever it happens to the names I congratulate of people worried about the Castilian in Catalonia. You have won now, Swiss Airways will take out the Catalan. Congratulations to all of you. Freedom must prevail Long live the English language and the Spanish too.

  9. anonin2
    December 17th 2008 13:26

    By reading Trevor comment that the names should be related to the way they are mostly said )"I believe that maps should adopt the bottom-up approach by reflecting actual usage") I imagine we should change Calella for Calela. And Venezia should be changed to Venice. Maybe, too, as some people pronounce Trebor instead of Trevor, Trevor should think about changing his name too. I propose to change names in order to make happy some people like Trebor, sorry, Trevor. Let's say Sabadel, Vendrel. No account should be taken to the official language of Catalonia. Names should be look Spanish or even English as English and Spanish have more usage.

  10. Trevor
    December 17th 2008 13:47

    Don't misrepresent my words for your miserable ends. I said "A more sensible solution would be to present toponyms on the basis of a user's global language choice. This is more or less the approach adopted by Wikipedia, and I think it works reasonably well." I'm opposed to both the de-Catalanisation of toponyms by totalitarians in the 1940s and their de-Castilianisation by a new generation of totalitarians starting in the 1980s.

  11. Monster Ball
    December 17th 2008 20:40

    Dear Trebor, by the same token you should oppose de-Nazification and de-Stalinisation wherever they may take place, since both have an in-built element of coercion.

    As to de-Catalanisation..well, it's work in progress, isn't it? Catalans are now to all intents and purposes in the minority within Catalonia, something reflected by the fact that the regional president of their semi home-rule govt. is none other than a PSOE apparatchik, not a Catalan nationalist by any stretch of the imagination -as opposed to, say, Scotland.

    So I honestly can't see why you and other champions of Spanish culture & language have so much to gripe and moan about: irreversible assimiliation's well under way, with Spanish firmly established as the default option as language choice goes.

    Actually, forcibly italianising South Tyrol toponyms never did the Italian state any good in its quest for national unity, as you know, it only fostered resentment among local people.

    If you really want to advance the cause of assimilation, don't go around antagonising the Catalans, but rather let them feel better just because they're allowed to use the likes of Girona, Lleida, Port de la Selva or even -my favourite-"Reial" Madrid, while talking to you -need I say so?- in Spanish.

  12. Tom
    December 18th 2008 15:34

    @Monster: as you may or may not no, 'Reial' Madrid is right on the money, what with it being founded by Catalans 'n' all.

  13. Tom
    December 18th 2008 15:35

    *By 'no' I obviously meant 'know' not 'no' and no, I don't know what I'm doing.

  14. Ian Llorens
    December 31st 2008 02:27

    This finally proves that Trevor is an immigrant and not an expat. If he were an expat, he would live in Sant Cugat and would be totally against San Cucufate as toponym.

  15. Trevor
    January 2nd 2009 13:51

    I can't be a real immigrant or, according to Geli, I would have had a baby at 00:01 yesterday.

  16. Ian Llorens
    January 3rd 2009 16:38

    Trevor,
    You have been in Catalonia for too long and therefore, as most of the Catalans, you miss the other necessary ingredient, to have "cojones".

  17. Trevor
    January 4th 2009 12:10

    You're going to have to work harder than that to get me to post video here.

  18. Ian Llorens
    January 4th 2009 15:38

    Trevor,
    I will patiently wait until there is streaming video in high resolution.

  19. Trevor
    January 5th 2009 13:38

    Your manifested tastes suggest that my residence in Cataloonia would be rather less improbable than yours in one of the more buttoned-up parts of the USA

 
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